Deeper research on:
MINICOM DISK TO TAPE COPY UTILITY
There's a clue in:
Bruce Ray on emulating a Point 4 system
"Most of the
IRIS-similar backup utilities (disk-to-tape-to-disk) were simple sector
copy programs, usually the entire disk (or a LU subset).
MCT (MiniComputer Technology), Lotus, and Rianda controllers were popular 3rd-party products in the '70s and '80s."
Sunday, May 1, 2016
Old Operating Systems Don’t Die…
Excerpts pulled from:
Old Operating Systems Don’t Die…
So you think Windows XP is an old timer? These OSes from the distant past just won't quit.
By Harry McCracken | Thursday, September 17, 2009 at 1:37 am
Rob Says:
November 11th, 2010 at 9:42 pm
Who used or remembers IRIS by Point 4 Data Corp? We bought a Point 4 Mini (Data General clone) for our busy tire / auto repair shop back in 1984 and used it until 1995. The ONLY reason we retired it was because we outgrew the application software. IRIS was a very smart O/S for the time, Stable and very efficient.
Only time it was ever rebooted was because of upgrades or power failures. Second system was DOS based, ok but again not flexible. Now we use Windows SBS 2003, XP clients. MUST REBOOT ALL OF THE TIME!
Frank Says:
January 21st, 2012 at 1:15 am
Hi Rob, I programmed in DG basic (Originally Randal Data Systems Business Basic) for many years, and more still on Point 4's. Extremely reliable, never went down. So much fun. I recently found a bunch of old Point 4 backup tapes and I'm trying to find someone who can read them. I'd love to see the code that I spent 1000's of hours writing. Know anyone who still has a functional Point 4?( I'd be willing to purchase it), or anyone who might be able to read these? (dr.sapienza1@verizon.net) Thanks!!
[by the way, we have emailed Frank, since he is asking for someone who is essentially doing exactly what we are doing here. We'll keep you all posted on what happens].
Old Operating Systems Don’t Die…
So you think Windows XP is an old timer? These OSes from the distant past just won't quit.
By Harry McCracken | Thursday, September 17, 2009 at 1:37 am
Rob Says:
November 11th, 2010 at 9:42 pm
Who used or remembers IRIS by Point 4 Data Corp? We bought a Point 4 Mini (Data General clone) for our busy tire / auto repair shop back in 1984 and used it until 1995. The ONLY reason we retired it was because we outgrew the application software. IRIS was a very smart O/S for the time, Stable and very efficient.
Only time it was ever rebooted was because of upgrades or power failures. Second system was DOS based, ok but again not flexible. Now we use Windows SBS 2003, XP clients. MUST REBOOT ALL OF THE TIME!
Frank Says:
January 21st, 2012 at 1:15 am
Hi Rob, I programmed in DG basic (Originally Randal Data Systems Business Basic) for many years, and more still on Point 4's. Extremely reliable, never went down. So much fun. I recently found a bunch of old Point 4 backup tapes and I'm trying to find someone who can read them. I'd love to see the code that I spent 1000's of hours writing. Know anyone who still has a functional Point 4?( I'd be willing to purchase it), or anyone who might be able to read these? (dr.sapienza1@verizon.net) Thanks!!
[by the way, we have emailed Frank, since he is asking for someone who is essentially doing exactly what we are doing here. We'll keep you all posted on what happens].
Larry Irwin on the Point 4 IRIS
Consolidated from: http://en.allexperts.com/q/Unix-Linux-OS-1064/2015/8/fun-old-point-4.htm
Expert: mkitwrk - 8/17/2015 (Larry Irwin)
Question (from Tim Plummer)
Not really a question just a comment. Being an old Point 4 VAR I search for Point 4 stuff under as many different search terms as I can. Over the years it had been fun to find the different people associated with Point 4. For example I have as Mark 12 board pinned to my wall. I look for stories from other that I find on the web and am curious about your history with Point 4.
Saturday, April 30, 2016
IRIS and SimH on alt.folklore.computers - from 2006
From a newsgroup thread called Looking for Johnson's pcc - DG Nova and Eclipse
This seems to contain some good IRIS OS overview knowledge from the perspective of an experienced past user, (possibly) John L Wright, Jr from Arargh.com
http://domainiac.tech/reviews/arargh.com
http://www.whois.com/whois/arargh.com
The thread was written 10 years ago, almost to the day, but hopefully still contains relevant info about the IRIS environment.
Here are the IRIS-relevant extracts from that:
Arargh.com:
Another issue, do I write it for the only Nova OS that I have (IRIS
from EDS, later Point4) or standalone?
Also, write for a stock Nova, or the modified clone processors that I
have. The ones I have support 64k words of core, but you lose the
LDA/STA memory indirect chaining feature. But they will run as stock.
This seems to contain some good IRIS OS overview knowledge from the perspective of an experienced past user, (possibly) John L Wright, Jr from Arargh.com
http://domainiac.tech/reviews/arargh.com
http://www.whois.com/whois/arargh.com
Here are the IRIS-relevant extracts from that:
Arargh.com:
Another issue, do I write it for the only Nova OS that I have (IRIS
from EDS, later Point4) or standalone?
Also, write for a stock Nova, or the modified clone processors that I
have. The ones I have support 64k words of core, but you lose the
LDA/STA memory indirect chaining feature. But they will run as stock.
Thursday, April 28, 2016
Wild Hare's reNOVAte Demo Version 4.0B.06
We are attempting to use a demo version of reNOVAte, a DG-style emulator produced by Bruce Ray at Wild Hare Computer Systems.
http://www.wildharecomputers.com/products/renovate.php
The demo version was downloaded from this page:
http://www.novasareforever.org/downloads/downloads.htm
We are using the "Win/95/98/Millenium/NT/2000/XP" version.
Bruce has very kindly and generously provided us with a software key to use this demo version.
An old version of the reNOVAte manual can be found here:
http://www.novasareforever.org/downloads/reNOVAte.pdf
We are trying to use this version to re-create the successful running of the program "Minicom Disk To Tape Copy Utility", that Bruce demonstrated in screen shots, shown here.
Minicom Disk To Tape Utility tells a story...
http://www.wildharecomputers.com/products/renovate.php
The demo version was downloaded from this page:
http://www.novasareforever.org/downloads/downloads.htm
We are using the "Win/95/98/Millenium/NT/2000/XP" version.
Bruce has very kindly and generously provided us with a software key to use this demo version.
An old version of the reNOVAte manual can be found here:
http://www.novasareforever.org/downloads/reNOVAte.pdf
We are trying to use this version to re-create the successful running of the program "Minicom Disk To Tape Copy Utility", that Bruce demonstrated in screen shots, shown here.
Minicom Disk To Tape Utility tells a story...
Tuesday, April 12, 2016
Microtech Dart Utility Rev 2.6
We have just successfully read the Microtech Dart Utility Rev 2.6 QIC tape cartridge.
The format is a very clean QIC-11, with 24 files, and all files fit on a single track (Track 0). We used our own invented process to read this tape, documented here.
The first file is 512 bytes, the second file is 20480 bytes, and all of the rest of the files are 46080 bytes.
The format is a very clean QIC-11, with 24 files, and all files fit on a single track (Track 0). We used our own invented process to read this tape, documented here.
The first file is 512 bytes, the second file is 20480 bytes, and all of the rest of the files are 46080 bytes.
This one seems to actually be what is on the label: an original install program. Also, this is the only tape of any tapes in our sets of tapes, where we can actually find any instance of the word "Microtech".
Thursday, March 31, 2016
Star Computer Group, Star Technologies, and Microtech Business Systems - Incorporation Records
We are culling this information from public records, in order to gain more of a firm timeline on these machines, and the contents that we are finding on these tapes (dates, company names, etc.)
Star Technologies is sometimes displayed as Star*Technologies
Star Technologies is sometimes displayed as Star*Technologies
Sunday, March 27, 2016
Dropping the Highest Order Bit
John Svee at Data Conversion Resource / Trusted Data Solutions found one of our posts/pages at this site, and has provided us a GOLDMINE of knowledge, as to how to decipher the data that I've extracted from all of the tapes that I reference as part of this Microtech / Point 4 restoration project.
Here it is, in his own words:
When doing research for a current project involving 4-track QIC tape data (DC-300 tapes) I came across “http://microtechm1.blogspot. com/2015/11/microtech-m134- iris-r7-tape-read.html”.
I downloaded and worked with the tape file (IRIS-Track 0Fthru2F-whole file.bin) and made some observations.
1.) Some data is readable ASCII as you pointed out.
Here it is, in his own words:
To whom it may concern,
When doing research for a current project involving 4-track QIC tape data (DC-300 tapes) I came across “http://microtechm1.blogspot.
I downloaded and worked with the tape file (IRIS-Track 0Fthru2F-whole file.bin) and made some observations.
1.) Some data is readable ASCII as you pointed out.
Saturday, November 21, 2015
Minicom Disk To Tape Utility tells a story...
Bruce Ray at novasareforever.org actually was able to get this utility file to RUN!
The raw binary file can be downloaded from here: http://bit.ly/1NklvGj
(Reference my original page with the MINICOM DISK TO TAPE UTILITY)
Here's how, in Bruce's words:
The tape contains a disk/tape backup/restore utility that is somewhat representative of those used with Point 4, and other 3rd-party DG lookalike systems. It is a stand-alone utility that is bootable if it exists as the first record of the first file of a mag tape or cartridge.
The usual procedure is to bootstrap the tape using the Nova APL function (or just toggling in simple 2-instruction 'fat-finger' program). Once the program is read into memory, it starts execution and displays its introductory message. At this point another tape/cartridge may be loaded onto the tape drive for backup or restore purposes.
I used our reNOVAte software (see reNOVAte manual) for doing my investigations rather than SimH due to convenience, and was able to run the program and exercise its various functions.
The raw binary file can be downloaded from here: http://bit.ly/1NklvGj
(Reference my original page with the MINICOM DISK TO TAPE UTILITY)
Here's how, in Bruce's words:
The tape contains a disk/tape backup/restore utility that is somewhat representative of those used with Point 4, and other 3rd-party DG lookalike systems. It is a stand-alone utility that is bootable if it exists as the first record of the first file of a mag tape or cartridge.
The usual procedure is to bootstrap the tape using the Nova APL function (or just toggling in simple 2-instruction 'fat-finger' program). Once the program is read into memory, it starts execution and displays its introductory message. At this point another tape/cartridge may be loaded onto the tape drive for backup or restore purposes.
I used our reNOVAte software (see reNOVAte manual) for doing my investigations rather than SimH due to convenience, and was able to run the program and exercise its various functions.
Wednesday, November 11, 2015
Microtech M1/34 IRIS Operating System R7 Tape Read
The tape has QIC-11 formatted data across the first 3 tracks of the tape, and appears to be all one file, (with only one filemark at the end of the data on the 3rd track). Track 4 appears to be blank.
It's approximately 13.7Mb file, and it can be downloaded for analysis here.
Sunday, November 1, 2015
LOTUS CACHE MEMORY DIAGNOSTIC PROGRAM
In reverse-endian from the rest of the file, I found yet another utility:
LOTUS CACHE MEMORY DIAGNOSTIC PROGRAM
REV 1.1 FEB 4,1982
Here's a download of the full binary extraction from the entire Track 0 with the endianness exactly as it was on the tape, and here's a reverse-endian version which more clearly revealed this text.
This text extract begins at address 0xC2620.
LOTUS CACHE MEMORY DIAGNOSTIC PROGRAM
REV 1.1 FEB 4,1982
This text extract begins at address 0xC2620.
Sunday, October 18, 2015
Logical Units vs Positions
Written on every Microtech backup tape we have is a nomenclature of Logical Units and Positions, such as "Logical Unit 0, position 1", or abbreviated: "LU 0, pos 1;"... and so on, or some mixture thereof.
I've been told by those more familiar with this vintage technology that I should think of Logical Units as hard drive partitions. But then what do the positions mean?
Google wasn't any help to me on this. Searching the phrase that now is the title of this post revealed nothing that really matched. So, I was left to guess.
And, well, maybe I was looking at it the wrong way. I was thinking that the Logical Units and the Positions both had to do with the hard drive, but maybe this excerpt from the MTCopy manual sheds some light on this.
So, maybe the Logical Units represent the partitions on the hard drive, but the positions represent the position that the Logical Unit is now holding on the QIC tape. Could this be it? I'm starting to think so.
I wondered why LU 0, 1 and 2, corresponded with Pos 1, 2 and 3, but LU 3 and 4 corresponded again with pos 1 and 2 instead of 4 and 5, but if the position means the position on the tape, and has nothing to do with the position on the hard drive, then this makes sense. LU 3 is the first file after the BOOT file on the 2nd tape, so it is pos 1.
Mystery solved...I hope...
I've been told by those more familiar with this vintage technology that I should think of Logical Units as hard drive partitions. But then what do the positions mean?
Google wasn't any help to me on this. Searching the phrase that now is the title of this post revealed nothing that really matched. So, I was left to guess.
And, well, maybe I was looking at it the wrong way. I was thinking that the Logical Units and the Positions both had to do with the hard drive, but maybe this excerpt from the MTCopy manual sheds some light on this.
Interesting how it says "Each tape in your set of backups will contain the bootable portion followed by the individual logical units."
So, maybe the Logical Units represent the partitions on the hard drive, but the positions represent the position that the Logical Unit is now holding on the QIC tape. Could this be it? I'm starting to think so.
I wondered why LU 0, 1 and 2, corresponded with Pos 1, 2 and 3, but LU 3 and 4 corresponded again with pos 1 and 2 instead of 4 and 5, but if the position means the position on the tape, and has nothing to do with the position on the hard drive, then this makes sense. LU 3 is the first file after the BOOT file on the 2nd tape, so it is pos 1.
Mystery solved...I hope...
Wednesday, October 14, 2015
Bruce Ray on emulating a Point 4 system
From October 14, 2015, to me by email:
The standard Point 4 Mark x instruction set was compatible with the "classic" DG Nova instruction set, and each company added additional instructions over the years. DG added additional instructions to the "classic" Nova set starting with the Nova 3 and Nova 4 - primarily stack and byte operations.
Peripheral controllers could be program-compatible or divergent, it just depends upon how the computer is configured. Some Point 4 systems (the Mark 2/3) had some integrated disk/tape/multiplexor peripherals that were total incompatible with anything else, and therefore required special knowledgeable programming. Other configurations we dealt with used the Lotus 700 series controllers which could be compatible with certain DG disk and tape drives (but had extended capabilities).
EDS/Point 4 created a higher-performance terminal multiplexor that was not DG compatible, but we have also seen Bytronix and CSI (Custom Systems) multiplexors in client systems (and therefore support them in our commercial reNOVAte product). Of course, "standard" DG-compatible multiplexors could be used in Point 4 systems as well.
So the procedure we use when receiving a client "mystery tape" is to boot the tape and dynamically trace the user program program to determine what device(s) are being accessed. Then, depending upon the device codes and I/O instructions used (and a bit of our decades of experience with these systems), we can guestimate what controller and disk device is assumed by the user program.
The SimH Nova emulator can emulate some of the possible IRIS configurations, but "it just depends".
Most of the IRIS-similar backup utilities (disk-to-tape-to-disk) were simple sector copy programs, usually the entire disk (or a LU subset).
MCT (MiniComputer Technology), Lotus, and Rianda controllers were popular 3rd-party products in the '70s and '80s.
I have enclosed information for the tape/disk copy programs for your entertainment
The standard Point 4 Mark x instruction set was compatible with the "classic" DG Nova instruction set, and each company added additional instructions over the years. DG added additional instructions to the "classic" Nova set starting with the Nova 3 and Nova 4 - primarily stack and byte operations.
Peripheral controllers could be program-compatible or divergent, it just depends upon how the computer is configured. Some Point 4 systems (the Mark 2/3) had some integrated disk/tape/multiplexor peripherals that were total incompatible with anything else, and therefore required special knowledgeable programming. Other configurations we dealt with used the Lotus 700 series controllers which could be compatible with certain DG disk and tape drives (but had extended capabilities).
EDS/Point 4 created a higher-performance terminal multiplexor that was not DG compatible, but we have also seen Bytronix and CSI (Custom Systems) multiplexors in client systems (and therefore support them in our commercial reNOVAte product). Of course, "standard" DG-compatible multiplexors could be used in Point 4 systems as well.
So the procedure we use when receiving a client "mystery tape" is to boot the tape and dynamically trace the user program program to determine what device(s) are being accessed. Then, depending upon the device codes and I/O instructions used (and a bit of our decades of experience with these systems), we can guestimate what controller and disk device is assumed by the user program.
The SimH Nova emulator can emulate some of the possible IRIS configurations, but "it just depends".
Most of the IRIS-similar backup utilities (disk-to-tape-to-disk) were simple sector copy programs, usually the entire disk (or a LU subset).
MCT (MiniComputer Technology), Lotus, and Rianda controllers were popular 3rd-party products in the '70s and '80s.
I have enclosed information for the tape/disk copy programs for your entertainment
Sunday, October 4, 2015
POINT 4 DISK SUBSYSTEM UTILITY & LOTUS 700 DISK CONTROLLER DIAGNOSTICS
On the next Microtech backup tape that I am restoring,
( Labeled LU0-pos1; LU1-pos2; LU2-pos3 ),
on track 0, I found these 2 segments with text in "English":
POINT 4 DISK SUBSYSTEM UTILITY
VERSION 1.4 SEP 17 1980
LOTUS 700 DISK CONTROLLER DIAGNOSTICS
VERSION 1.7 JAN 31 1981
I'll be posting the full text versions soon, along with my guess of the full binaries.
Here's a download of the full binary extraction from the entire Track 0. Note, I added my own artistic interpretation to delineate filemarks. Just search for the text "filemark" in your hex editor/reader.
Does this give us better clues as to what model, vintage, etc of Microtech machine that these once backed up?
( Labeled LU0-pos1; LU1-pos2; LU2-pos3 ),
on track 0, I found these 2 segments with text in "English":
POINT 4 DISK SUBSYSTEM UTILITY
VERSION 1.4 SEP 17 1980
LOTUS 700 DISK CONTROLLER DIAGNOSTICS
VERSION 1.7 JAN 31 1981
I'll be posting the full text versions soon, along with my guess of the full binaries.
Here's a download of the full binary extraction from the entire Track 0. Note, I added my own artistic interpretation to delineate filemarks. Just search for the text "filemark" in your hex editor/reader.
Does this give us better clues as to what model, vintage, etc of Microtech machine that these once backed up?
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